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Sile
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Tue Aug 26, 2008 10:20 pm

Caxi wrote:
Weninho wrote:
If I think Rossi is the man to guide Lazio toward the top of serie A, is however another question. But we're not even close to ready for that jump yet, so to appoint a manager for that mission would be like buying a Ferrari to your 14-year old son. Useless.

Yes, you need certain coaches for certain tasks. I know Delio can get a team to play in difficult circumstances (Atalanta). However, Lazio is a few steps up and although I think Delio has stood up, he has also fallen. Now he needs to pick himself up, dust himself down and prove his worth.

Exactly. We can't afford to rest on laurels. We were eliminated from the CL far too early for it to be a reason for some displays in the rest of the domestic season. Delio surely can't be blamed for the way some players performed but looking at the squad we had it's not like he did not have a decent sub in most cases.
I definitely don't want him gone, but this season he really has no excuse so good luck Mister and don't disappoint.

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Caxi
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Tue Aug 26, 2008 10:45 pm

CL and injuries were a problem but only for periods of the season, what worried me was the team's poor performance when things were fine. I'm still worried about certain elements. If he plays Siviglia in his best XI, he is nouts, if he plays Makinwa and Manfredini a lot, he is nuts, if he keeps Foggia as a sub, he is nuts, if he doesn't give Zarate a chance, he is nuts, if he exiles players again, he is nuts.

We don't know the potential of this squad because we had one season that exceeded expectations and another that didn't get anywhere near expectations. For all we know, this side can win Serie A, for all we know, we could be relegation candidates and it's all because Delio doesn't know himself what he has. We need to go Top 6 this season. I wanted Delio to stay although the likes of Acori were appealing at the time...
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nomade
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Tue Aug 26, 2008 11:40 pm

Well Jo, Rossi has lost it last year, the atmosphere isn't quite promising this year, and the tactics aren't convincing, the way he uses players sucks, and I've never been able to give him coherent excuses...

If he doesn't pull it together this year, he should leave, I am not an anti rossi, but I don't think he has done the best job here yet, I am not talking about leading serie A, we are not ready for that, and I don't know if we'll be in the next decade, we are so underachieving and Rossi takes a good part of the blame, and I wish I was one of thsoe people with a good enough memory to remind you of some of his messed up games...

Because until the first half of the last season I';ve been all pro Rossi...And I am still with him as long as he's our coach, but he has lost it last season...

I hope I can eat my words back, I hope he proves me wrong, but I don't expect that much from him anymore. And I am not looking for a CL spot...
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Tue Aug 26, 2008 11:47 pm

I would just like to add that it's very interesting to see that Lotito hasn't offered Rossi a new contract. Lotito doesn't want to tie him down on a long term basis. He has already made contact with a lot of other coaches before the end of last season and even during the Summer.

My impression is that the next few months are crucial to Rossi's future at Lazio. If things go badly in the next six months it will be very easy for Lotito to sack Rossi seeing as Delio will only have less than a year left on his contract.
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 12:13 am

I'd hate to see him sacked so soon depending on results, players do a whole summer with a coach and then have to learn a new system, just doesn't seem like a positive in theory.
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 12:18 am

It is impossible to be in the top 4 with Inter, Milan, Juve and Roma not to forget Fiorentina too. Meanwhile, Napoli, Samp, Udinese, and Genoa are all competitive for UEFA cup spot, in all honesty Lazio is behind them and thanks to amature coach who still persists on handicaps like Makinwa and Manfradini and keeps Foggia and Zarate on the bench!

Rossi gesture against Zarate in the Coppa is totally unacceptable in any football law or behaviour of a normal healthy individual! Leading by 5 goals against Serie C side and keeping the biggest flop in the field for the whole 90 mins without even to consider Zarate for 5 min only!!

I start to believe that Ross is the main trouble maker in Lazio's dressing room, players who are leaving are right about their thoughts on Rossi fielding his beloved 11 that is definitely not the best solution, best quality, and most inform players! I am sick on this smelling as, as I am already counting his days as a misrable season like the past one is in the horrizon with such mentality and dump thoughts.

Thanks for the Curva for their cheers against Mafradini and Makinwa that is some relief for the fans that the only mistake they did was following this Lazio side with Rossi incharge! Plz Lotito bring back Inzaghi and Muta who are stars when compared to them as I don't want to see those clowns in Lazio jerseay anymore! Plz guys lets write to this lost minded coach!
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Caxi
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 1:52 am

I'd just like to add something. Whatever went on the dressing room last year is immaterial now, but Delio must be held responsible. When the most loyal player in the squad kicks up a fuss (Zauri) then you know the coach is at fault because Zauri has seen many a coach at Lazio and had few problems. I can't forget that we have lost Zauri and will lose Stendardo, Mutarelli and other good players because they and Delio had some issues. the fact that Delio will instead rely on the mediocre players who lick his behind (Makinwa, Manfredini, Siviglia etc.) is a cause for concern. I don't think Delio should be sacked over this, however, this squad is now stronger than 2 years ago, when we got to the CL on merit, we were as good then as Milan and Fiorentina, at least in the league anyway and we were all effected by Calciopoli. Now Juventus have come up and the big guns have spent, we should be sixth. We need to be sixth or thereabouts season in, season out and we need to be knocking on the door of the CL like Samp and Udinese did last year. If Delio doesn't do that, then he should be sent packing and it's not Lotito's fault that Delio has made his own job harder by having what seems like unresolvable problems with players. If Delio seels Stendardo and Lotito can't afford or find a replacement, then tough luck Delio, it was your wish. When finances are like ours, we need to keep good players and Delio is not doing that and if we end up behind genoa and Napoli because of it then he deserves to go.
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Gartz
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 2:43 am

Weninho wrote:
I don't agree that "we are so underachieving". We finished 11, after a season in Champions League, that's far from a disaster. If you look at the teams above us, only two teams I would rank lower if you look at the player material - Atalanta and Genoa. The rest I would say had an equal or better roster. I think it's hard to underachieve with players like Del Nero, Tare, Vignaroli, Stendardo, Muslera, Ballotta, Manfredini, Mudingayi etc in the FIRST team. Who were they before they came to Lazio? They could seriously play for a serie B-side. And is it really fair to blame Rossi for everything when it's obvious we didn't have the material?

Well, I think I think I had posted this somewhere, but anyway Delio Rossi is the best coach we can have under Lotito, which means we do have a limit with management meaning also for coaching as well.

Signore Rossi is good in making a Serie B product to a Serie A material, but over the years I have felt he has the limit to bring out the talents of top prospects such as Foggia, Jimenez, etc. to another level.

Again with Lotito, I still think Rossi would be one of the better coach who would want to keep his job under Lotwyto.
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 3:26 am

Rossi will never be a great coach if he keeps playing with Manfredini and Makinwa. Simple as that. Rather play with some 16-17 years old youngster. It makes me wanna puke everytime I see Manfredini and Makinwa on the pich.
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 3:55 am

I am not a Delio fan, but many people here just exaggerate the facts. Rossi has his faults and the people have the right to resent(due to last season results, it is understandable). But I don't think , he should be a scapegoat also..... Lets face it, you just don't like his approach and in many occasions his tactics(so do I).....

It is just funny to see so extreme opinions, from people who are just ordinary supporters , and as Weninho wrote : Since we don't have access to the dressing room, it would be stupid to discuss the atmosphere and pretend I know exactly who fault it is !

My personal thoughts are that we don't and particularly didn't have enough quality players last season. I even don't want to remember what ridiculous problems we had then , from injury crisis to the lack of goalkeeper and so on. They were so many.

Just look our midfield, we didn't have a play maker there. Many of our goals were achievement of Rocchi and Pandev duet and understanding. How many times they had clear goal passes from our midfielders.....? In very rare occasions this could happen.
Just look at our defense , at our goalkeeper, who in may be 5 games has made disaster mistakes ,who cost us a lot of precious points.
And on the top of all, allegedly , we had and still have primadona players like Stendardo, Ledesma, Zauri etc.

And for all that Rossi has to take the guilt. I don't think so.

Regarding our pre season and all this claims that some players have been neglected , I find it very unfair. Because everyone has had his chance, some of them has spent more time on the field , but this was because of tactics reasons I believe. Zarate case is too exaggerated , Foggia case is too exaggerated. Just wait couple of real games and real time to see or not see them, because for me it is not serious that example from Coppa game, against Serie C team.
Makinwa was flop once again , but at some degree I can understand Rossis faith, they have mutual past and is understandable the willingness of our coach to regenerate his carrier. From tactical point he is the only one with such physic and playing characteristic. Maybe only Mauri and Rocchi at some point are near to his physics. We have players like Pandev , Zarate, Foggia who have similar abilities and maybe it wouldn't be the best if they are on the pitch in the same time.

But this are just thoughts, I don't pretend to be a pundit or something. After all, Rossi is our coach, good , bad this is it.
I think after all , our first matches this term will decide his faith on the Lazios helm.
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Caxi
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 4:15 am

I studied psychology last year and the one thing they make you learn is you can't dismiss the evidence, the facts.

The facts are, there were about 5 players who had a problem with Delio and about 3 who had issues with Lotito. Now, if i was to investigate the situation, the "evidence" would point me towards Delio...that doesn't mean he was the sole person responsible, but based on the evidence, the investigation should start there. If you see a crowd of people chase one man, you have to assume the one man is in the wrong and thus you may be tempted to follow the crowd in chasing the man. The only reason some people will take Delio's side over the players is because they respect authority. There is nothing wrong with that, it's just a question of how authoritarian is Delio?

Also, if i want to look at the reasons for why the team performed badly, common sense tells me to look at the coach first. If I run a company where all my staff underperform, I expect to be asked the questions rather than the staff.

What was our aim last year? I don't think we had a clear goal and Delio can't fail if there was nothing for him to succeed in. Now his job is to take us to the UEFA Cup. He should be given a season, if he fails, goodbye.
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 3:25 pm

Caxi wrote:
I studied psychology last year and the one thing they make you learn is you can't dismiss the evidence, the facts.

The facts are, there were about 5 players who had a problem with Delio and about 3 who had issues with Lotito. Now, if i was to investigate the situation, the "evidence" would point me towards Delio...that doesn't mean he was the sole person responsible, but based on the evidence, the investigation should start there. If you see a crowd of people chase one man, you have to assume the one man is in the wrong and thus you may be tempted to follow the crowd in chasing the man. The only reason some people will take Delio's side over the players is because they respect authority. There is nothing wrong with that, it's just a question of how authoritarian is Delio?

Also, if i want to look at the reasons for why the team performed badly, common sense tells me to look at the coach first. If I run a company where all my staff underperform, I expect to be asked the questions rather than the staff.

What was our aim last year? I don't think we had a clear goal and Delio can't fail if there was nothing for him to succeed in. Now his job is to take us to the UEFA Cup. He should be given a season, if he fails, goodbye.

I hope he hasn't problems with players this year. But it is really scary what happened this summer. Last year there was no problem with Mutarelli, he still played in some games. Now in the summer Rossi drops him like nothing. I think Rossi is very weak on the psychological side of being a coach. Nowadays, this is one of the most important facts of football. I wish to see Mancini come back, but he will be to expansive.
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 5:06 pm

Quote :
The facts are, there were about 5 players who had a problem with Delio and about 3 who had issues with Lotito.

Haven't you been also taught not to mix the words "facts" and "about"? Yes, cheap shot but this combination of words does sound rather odd when such low numbers are involved.

Anyway, almost all coaches have favourites - remember Mourinho sticking with Paulo Ferreira at Chelsea? Mancini who played Stankovic always in Inter, never mind the latter at times underperformed for months? Capello who played a certain DM called Lima as a left winger in rioma? Trappatoni who took 35 year old Di Livio to a World Cup? So as tempting as it sounds to get rid of Rossi and by extension get rid of or at least drastically reduce the playing time of Firmani, Manfredini and Makinwa, who is to say the next coach won't have some odd favourites of his own? And why is always the coach blamed for bad dressing room atmosphere - when Rossi said Di Canio was the biggest disruptive factor nobody believed him but if a player says the coach is to blame for some reason everyone jumps to the conclusion that this must be so. Even though the players feel wronged by the coach and are obviously biased in these cases.

Quote :
Since we don't have access to the dressing room, it would be stupid to discuss the atmosphere and pretend I know exactly who fault it is

Finally someone stated the obvious. Well put and I agree with almost everything you said in your post.
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guardia alta
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 5:42 pm

Secret_Samadhi wrote:
Rossi will never be a great coach if he keeps playing with Manfredini and Makinwa. Simple as that. Rather play with some 16-17 years old youngster. It makes me wanna puke everytime I see Manfredini and Makinwa on the pich.

come on man Wink
manfredini is a warm bencher.
how many caps last season?
how many minutes did he play since dabo welcome back?

manfredini plays always when there are at least 2 mid injured.
i.e vs benevento, dabo and firmani.
cheers.
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guardia alta
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 5:53 pm

Goerlandt wrote:
Caxi wrote:
I studied psychology last year and the one thing they make you learn is you can't dismiss the evidence, the facts.

The facts are, there were about 5 players who had a problem with Delio and about 3 who had issues with Lotito. Now, if i was to investigate the situation, the "evidence" would point me towards Delio...that doesn't mean he was the sole person responsible, but based on the evidence, the investigation should start there. If you see a crowd of people chase one man, you have to assume the one man is in the wrong and thus you may be tempted to follow the crowd in chasing the man. The only reason some people will take Delio's side over the players is because they respect authority. There is nothing wrong with that, it's just a question of how authoritarian is Delio?

Also, if i want to look at the reasons for why the team performed badly, common sense tells me to look at the coach first. If I run a company where all my staff underperform, I expect to be asked the questions rather than the staff.

What was our aim last year? I don't think we had a clear goal and Delio can't fail if there was nothing for him to succeed in. Now his job is to take us to the UEFA Cup. He should be given a season, if he fails, goodbye.

I hope he hasn't problems with players this year. But it is really scary what happened this summer. Last year there was no problem with Mutarelli, he still played in some games. Now in the summer Rossi drops him like nothing. I think Rossi is very weak on the psychological side of being a coach. Nowadays, this is one of the most important facts of football. I wish to see Mancini come back, but he will be to expansive.

zauri and mutarelli had serious problems with the rest of the group, not with delio.
delio just has to accept that.
did you hear one of the leaders (i. rocchi, ledema) spending a word for the former captain and for mutarelli)?

just as domizzi in napoli. he argued badly with someone else. now he wants to leave napoli beacause th dressing room doesn't want him.
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 6:18 pm

Ivan wrote:
I would just like to add that it's very interesting to see that Lotito hasn't offered Rossi a new contract. Lotito doesn't want to tie him down on a long term basis. He has already made contact with a lot of other coaches before the end of last season and even during the Summer.

My impression is that the next few months are crucial to Rossi's future at Lazio. If things go badly in the next six months it will be very easy for Lotito to sack Rossi seeing as Delio will only have less than a year left on his contract.

Wink
actually there was a club official press release dated in spring in which lotito stated that he offered delio the renewal.
delio replied with many press interviews the same old thing: he likes to work year per year.

i agree with you: i do believe that the 4 next months are so crucial.
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Caxi
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 6:25 pm

Matrim wrote:
Quote :
The facts are, there were about 5 players who had a problem with Delio and about 3 who had issues with Lotito.

Haven't you been also taught not to mix the words "facts" and "about"? Yes, cheap shot but this combination of words does sound rather odd when such low numbers are involved.

Haha, cheap shot maybe but I am not writing a paper and besides, everyone knows the names, I only said " about" to avoid listing and counting the names. For me, the numbers are not so small. Zauri had been at the club longer than Delio and it just seems weird that problems arose last year. The coach has to accept some of the blame...when he goes and alienates guys like Zauri, Baronio and Inzaghi who have been here for years then he shows a lack of respect and loyalty, aside from what we think of the said players.

If Zauri and Muta had problems with other individuals then Delio should have stopped that, it's his duty. I find it almost sad that, not only did he handle it all badly, but he shipped out the captain and not these other individuals. My issue has been all along that Delio exacerbated what was a controllable situation to the point where he had to resort to extreme measures in a bid to diffuse it. Most of us are concerned that the problem hasn't diffused and rightly so.
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 6:25 pm

Weninho wrote:

Let's see how it's proceding. The pre-season doesn't mean anything, and I'm excited to see how he choose to play on sunday.

I agree let's see, and I liked Rossi, I don't hate him now, but what he does, hasn't been exactly working for a while. So he has this season, I am not for replacing coaches right now.

This is me expressing my lack of confidence in Rossi rather than being judgemental. But I certainly hope I am wrong, not for Rossi's sake...
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Caxi
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Wed Aug 27, 2008 11:37 pm

I can't really argue with that Weninho but I definitely see things differently. Perhaps I am not explaining myself well and maybe I have been a bit harsh, but the ultimate point for me is that IF he relies on the likes of Makinwa and Manfredini when he could have got in adequate back ups IF he didn't sell the troublemakers is not an excuse for him. Zauri has a problem after 6/7 years at Lazio and Delio decides to sell him? He was the captain! Send out the wrong message, it tells me that Delio can't mediate and if that's the case then he is not good enough to manage us. He can sell the troublemakers if he wants. I can foresee a problem. If there were "groups" and Delio has only dismissed one group, then other "groups" must remain and if Delio can't mediate when these "groups" cause problems again then we have issues. Big issues. If that's the case, Delio can't solve it and he needs to go.
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Sile
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Thu Aug 28, 2008 2:37 am

guardia alta wrote:
Secret_Samadhi wrote:
Rossi will never be a great coach if he keeps playing with Manfredini and Makinwa. Simple as that. Rather play with some 16-17 years old youngster. It makes me wanna puke everytime I see Manfredini and Makinwa on the pich.

come on man Wink
manfredini is a warm bencher.
how many caps last season?
how many minutes did he play since dabo welcome back?

manfredini plays always when there are at least 2 mid injured.
i.e vs benevento, dabo and firmani.
cheers.

I just want to go on record that this sentence sounds extremely gay. No offense to gay ppl.

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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Thu Aug 28, 2008 11:42 am

no offence at all, sile, he's an excellent pro, now 33 years old.
he cames out from the bench when necessary.

that's it.
he plays with our club because he still benefits from huge cragnotti wages and lotito had to extend the agreement in order to pay less in the single year.

i really appreciate the man, he's honest.
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Fri Aug 29, 2008 10:11 am

Somebody can ask Rossi why is he using Makinwa and not Zarate?I don't understand this...He's a professional coach and he can't see that this guy is 0 ?We play football on goals not on favourite players...
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Sun Aug 31, 2008 10:51 am

Rossi: Lotito gave me nothing
Sunday 31 August, 2008

Delio Rossi sees Lazio’s seasonal debut as “the first day of school,” although he had very harsh words for President Claudio Lotito.

“It is a new season, a new experience and feels like the first day of school,” said the tactician ahead of today’s trip to Cagliari.

“I have a squad up to the task that can open up a new era, like the players that preceded them. I don’t know what role we’ll take in this campaign, a lot of that will depend on the spirit we show.”

The Biancocelesti have been the subject of tension and in-fighting for some time and Rossi does not hide his irritation at the transfer policy of the club.

“I have asked for nothing from the President. That is partly because every time I did make a request, nobody ever arrived,” he sniped.

At least there is one new signing the Coach is happy with – former Milan midfielder Cristian Brocchi.

“Brocchi is already fit and I am thinking about maybe starting him straight away. We picked him because we needed someone who could embody different positions and have experience.”

The more glamorous summer signing is Mauro Zarate, who spent last season on loan at Birmingham City.

“Zarate has quality, but he is young and comes from another type of football,” warned Rossi.

“He reminds me of Goran Pandev at the start of his career and I hope he can mature to follow the same path. The trouble is that in Rome anyone who puts in a decent cross is treated like a phenomenon and then the expectations soar. We need patience with Zarate.”



I hope, it will explain some of you, why Rossi doesn't put Zarate into a starting eleven.

And more about Lotito. At the beginning of the summer he explained why he didn't sign Bianchi. The explanation was: He doesn't fit into Lazio's tactical system. But few days ago Rossi denied it by saying that Bianchi was out of Lazio's economical parameters. And than Torino signed him No
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Caxi
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Sun Aug 31, 2008 1:11 pm

We have all seen the evidence to suggest Lotito is having quite a large say on who plays for this club. Firstly, Foggia was brought back and I think that was the one guy Delio did not want in the side. However, I think Foggia has proved that he can be relied upon and has thus gained the coach's respect.

The Bianchi-Zarate thing makes sense. At the time, Man City wanted 12 million and I think Lotito wanted someone who cost a lot less. Therefore it would make a lot of sense that Lotito would want to bring in Zarate. I can't see why Delio should be given the money or trust to invest in a striker when he splashed out close to 7 million on Makinwa. As he has spent that much money on the guy, I can see why Delio plays him so much. From comments made in the media, it is clear Claudio holds a higher regard for Zarate than Delio.

The transfer problems stem back to last season. Honestly, I believe the Stendardo issue has a lot to do with Lotito. I think Moti is a guy Claudio may have lined up in case Delio got his wish in selling Stendardo. The thing for me always was that Claudio would slap a higher valuation on Guglielmo than Delio would. I have to draw the conclusion that Claudio is behind the reintigration of Inzaghi too, based on the fact that Delio doesn't play him all that much.

The secret to a good transfer policy is having a budget, sticking to it and having the manager work within the limits. When the manager goes and blows close to 7 million on a striker who can't score goals then it doesn't inspire faith. Lotito, I hope, is not making final decisions on players, however, as the club president, he will want to see the club follow his vision, whatever his motives. Presumably, when he hired Delio, he did so in the hope that they would share common ideas and ambitions. Delio needs to follow what is set out by Lotito; you don't see the likes of Ferguson or Wenger making negative comments to the media because those above them have tightened the purse strings.

I can't say who is right and who is wrong in this dilemma. What I can say is I would rather see the Foggias and Zarates play for this club than the Makinwas, Mauris and Manfredinis. Hope you can see my point.
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Bobbi
Lazio Eagle
Lazio Eagle


Number of posts : 2371
Age : 27
Country and city : Auckland NZ
Laziale since : 1999
Registration date : 2008-06-21

PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Sun Aug 31, 2008 3:19 pm

Lets see what lineup Rossi puts out today against Cagliari.... I am interested in knowing what formation he will use aswell - even though several websites have predicted the lineup and formation (4-4-2) but this is all mere speculation.... only when the team sheet presents itself 5 minutes before the start of the game will we know Rossi's ideas about how he wants to play Lazio this season and in what formation and which players in what roles. I have faith in this guy and always have - I want him to play Foggia and Stendardo more however and am glad he gives chances to Manfredini for example - as I think he does well for Lazio every time given a chance!

FORZA LAZIO!!!!
FORZA ROSSI!!!!
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PostSubject: Re: Delio Rossi.   Today at 3:30 pm

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