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conceicao14
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 11:38 am

Lucky Strike wrote:
Quote :
Luckystrike, I wish you read all your comments you have made. Very aggresive indeed Very Happy And you expect us to talk like adults, hoho.

With all due respect, if you read my first post in this topic, and you compare it to what he has written - I think you'll find quite a difference. I have no intentions to be aggressive (as I wrote in my first reply here) - but the way he was talking was pretty childish I thought.

Quote :
Cragnotti did very well for our club,. Yes it was unfortunate for what happened near the end, but the same thing happened to many other clubs. If it wasnt for Cragnotti, not many of us would ever even be here on this forum. So lets please respect Cragnotti. Grazie Sergio for the fond memories you left for us in our minds. There were very wonderful.

Sure thing. Then again this topic is about Lotito. And when people accuse Lotito for getting players on loan (in stead of buying them?), I point my finger at Cragnotti (unfortunate or not) because it was his way of spending money that caused many of our financial problems nowadays. Yes, we've had brilliant times with Cragnotti, but honestly I prefer a healthy way of 'existing'. It's very easy for an Abramovic to spend some millions on amazing players and create a top team - but I prefer someone who does it in a normal way.

Quote :
Ok, I dont really like Lotito. He is doesnt have a personality and likes to alienate himself. Fair enough it makes sense to buy players on loan to test them out and see if they are worth buying after one season. But that would mean we are very limited in the transfer market. The good players will get snapped up market price and we will be trying to get loan deals and lying to other clubs that we will definatly buy them and also tell players, ""we love you and come and play for us". But the problem is this, if you promise and then lie, it leaves a bad taste and you as a player, agent, etc would feel like you have been used.

Again with all due respect, but you don't seem to get it. Lotito has no choice whatsoever but to get players the way he's doing now. Lazio has no money, in stead - it has many (huge) debts. Lotito has managed to make an agreement with the bank so we can pay them over a period of no less than 23 years if I'm not wrong. The only reason we can't buy players like Zarate or Matuzalem (in stead of getting them on a loan) is because we don't have any money left after the past directors - however nice it was to be top of Europe back then.

Quote :
Lotito doesnt have much of a class and he is representing our club.. Fair enough, business is business and Lotito is doing things his way but he has to remember, he is representing our club. The club wouldnt have existed if it was for the fans.

Class? Are you talking about class? Is this an argument? Are you actually serious? And you're wrong about one thing: the club wouldn't have existed if it wasn't for Lotito. Which fans are you talking about here? The Irriducibili? The ones that (arguably) threatened Lotito and his family with their lives because they wouldn't get anymore free tickets and money for tifo?

Yawn!! Sleep
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 11:46 am

rather than write 500 words, let me say I tend to agree with Lucky Eagle and guardia alta

the only real problem with Lotito is he needs to bring lazialita' back

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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 12:18 pm

Seems like that argument is over now, so I am coming back and I agree with c.testa, guardia alta and lucky strike and weni to an extent. Truth is, I thought this club was dead and buried 5 years ago and seeing top players like Matuzalem and Zarate join the likes of Pandev at the club is very satisfying for me. I know Lotito is not the ideal representative for Lazialita but I have to give credit where it is due and he has taken the club from near demise to solid Serie A quality. Lazio haven't had excellent leaders in recent years, so Lotito is just another of the flawed ones.

As I don't know Lotito's motives behind taking control of the club then I won't be following the "Lotito Vattene" movement. Lotito is also better than 80% of the chairmen in England and probably 60-70% of the owners in Italy so I won't wish him gone. Of course, if a good honest laziale was to make a good offer then Lotito should sell but we can never know that. We can do a lot worse than Lotito, that's my opinion so I will settle for what we've got.
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 12:43 pm

From an article yesterday, coincidently:

"La mia più grande soddisfazione? Esser riuscito a salvare la Lazio." - My biggest satisfaction? Being successful saving Lazio.

"Comunque ho preso la Lazio non per interesse materiale e, se la salute mi assisterà, mi auguro di averla a vita." - I have not taken over Lazio for financial reasons, if my health allows it, I will do this for the rest of my life.
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centrocampista
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 1:12 pm

Biancocelesti wrote:
centrocampista wrote:

Does anyone in here actually belive that Lotito will pay the 13mil option on Matuzalem?? he wouldn't spend half of that on Jimmenez. Zarate is even more expensive (give or take a few dollars).

Off topic but the option is set at €8M

13mil usd is about 8mil euro.


Ok. The problem is that our loan deals pan out into nothing!! We didn't make any money of off behrami!!

I'm just saying today what you all will be saying (not all) at the end of the season.
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 1:27 pm

centrocampista wrote:
Biancocelesti wrote:
centrocampista wrote:

Does anyone in here actually belive that Lotito will pay the 13mil option on Matuzalem?? he wouldn't spend half of that on Jimmenez. Zarate is even more expensive (give or take a few dollars).

Off topic but the option is set at €8M

Ok. The problem is that our loan deals pan out into nothing!! We didn't make any money of off behrami!!

I'm just saying today what you all will be saying (not all) at the end of the season.

What loan deals pan into nothing? Bianchi? True, he didn't succeed at Lazio - but aren't you happy with Matuzalem? With Zarate? Once again: we do not have the money to buy all these players in one time (for the moment), and that is not Lotito's fault, you have to go back in history (before Lotito's era) to find the cause of our financial situation nowadays. Be happy he's bringing in these amazing players, while (!) making sure our finances are ok. I'm pretty damn satisfied with the transfers this season. Zarate - brilliant, Carrizo - brilliant, Matuzalem - brilliant, Lichtsteiner - very good, Rozehnal - solid, Radu - solid and promising, Brocchi - fair enough, Rocchi & Pandev renewals - brilliant.

Oh, and by the way, we got about 10 million dollars for Behrami (to West Ham United), and we got about 6 million euro (!) for Mudingayi (to Bologna), who Lotito brought in for free just a couple of years ago. Just saying.
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guardia alta
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 1:33 pm

valon was sold for 6.3 mln euros.
west ham refused to benefit of fifa art. 17 shortcut.
beltrami 's startegy worked out for valon was ridicolus.

valon now earns 1.2 mln net euros per year.
given that everyday life in london is more expensive than rome ...
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Dr.Madani
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 2:12 pm

Hello everybody,

I am the first member who attacked Lotito 4 years ago pirat Twisted Evil , and the thread I started stayed until our Laziofever forum came down (thanx Mad Dog cheers ).

In my opinion Lotito has/had 3 problems:
1-His very first few months when he made a bad mercato (not selling Cesar to Inter in exchange for 4 decent players and losing him to them later for peaunts + Quardi + Siqura who are bad Suspect Suspect )) and hired caso who was really bad (Rocchi also agrees although he was a starter with him No ) as he lead the team outta the UEFA cup GROUP stage and into 15th position , which worsened our finicial situation as we played Intertoto cup next summer and we were defeated by Marsille Neutral .

2-08/07 season SUMMER mercato which was bad by throughing that team into 3 competitions one of them was CL , and the fact that we had to play Balotta between the bars while the likes of Sereni (who saved Torino from relegation) were doing a great job elsewhere ...very BAD. No

but he kinda fixed the situation in the WINTER mercato (Rozenhal, Radu, Dabo and Bianchi)

Carizzo was coming but he did not?? you are the president and you had to fix the situation....no excuse because you are il presidente Twisted Evil .

3-His attitude towards some of the other people which turned them into enemies...many of the players who gave Lazio a lot turned against him when they left (Peruzzi, Negro, Couto,........) but not always we have a good relationship with the important ones in AC Milan for example.

The situation changed as the players who left recently said that their problem is with Rossi not Lotito (Baronio and Stendardo)
-Tifosi?
I am glad that the trouble makers who used to support themselves rather than SSL who used to get a penalty and a ban every now and then are not in the stands anymore.
-Loan deals?
Very smart...(Mauri, Cribari, Radu, Rozenhal, Foggia...) also not get stuck with (Oscar Lopez, Bianchi, Brayn Robert...)
-Foggia to Cagliari and us without a playmaker last year?
He left when we had Jimenez and when the later left Lotito got Meghni and Del Nero but Mauri got a bad injury.
-Jimenez?
When he smelled money $$$ he took off, I really hate him and partly (Mancini for that) because he left when SSL were about to play CL.
-Bianchi?
Our option was 12 mil and he went to Torino later on for 4 mil only ....I am more than happy that Lotito turned out to be smart.
-Di Canio?
It was smart getting him and letting him go....we needed the fans when he arrived and we needed the locker room when left because whatever happened in the locker room the Irriducibili knew about the next day.
-Behrami?
I think we paid Verona more than the 7 mil West Ham united paid us, but it is good he did not go for peanuts.
-Lichtsteiner?
-It was nobel paying Lille money and not using article 17 just like West Ham paid us.
-Foggia?
Excellent but true that he had problems with some players in Cagliari and reports say that he had a big Napolitanean friend to make fights for him
-Ledesma?
Shut up and learn from Pandev.
-Baronio and Inzaghi?
-They first signed for Lazio 10 years ago, saw many coaches and 3 presidents and did not prove themselves yet!!!!! give me a brake.
-Rossi?
We will see next year.
-Lucky Strike (not Eagle c.testa tongue Wink ) and guardia alta?
VERY GOOD!!!!!!!!!! I am happy that people from Rome have those opinions.
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 2:30 pm

Forget about the Behrami deal now...we sold him for 6.5million (approx.) and bought Lichtsteiner for 1,5million euro (approx.). Lichtsteiner is a better player and we made a 5million profit, that's what I feel. Also, we sold Mudi for 6million euro and brought in the experienced Brocchi for free. We will see, in time, if these were the correct decisions but I can see the reasoning in Lotito's mind.

He doesn't like letting go of players, hence he won't sell Ledesma unless he gets an incredible offer. He holds out on contracts for as long as he can because a penny saved goes a long way. I think his transfer policy is fantastic and warrants no criticism.

It's other issues that deserve the scrutiny...
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 2:42 pm

Guys let me make another point here

the man in charge of transfers in Italy is known as the DS. Our ex-DS was Walter Sabatini, and it was him calling the shots in 2007, the disaster mercato. Rossi made a personal request for Makinwa I believe.

So, Lotito's moves in the mercato have actually been better than we give credit.

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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 3:59 pm

Caxi wrote:
Forget about the Behrami deal now...we sold him for 6.5million (approx.) and bought Lichtsteiner for 1,5million euro (approx.). Lichtsteiner is a better player and we made a 5million profit, that's what I feel. Also, we sold Mudi for 6million euro and brought in the experienced Brocchi for free. We will see, in time, if these were the correct decisions but I can see the reasoning in Lotito's mind.

He doesn't like letting go of players, hence he won't sell Ledesma unless he gets an incredible offer. He holds out on contracts for as long as he can because a penny saved goes a long way. I think his transfer policy is fantastic and warrants no criticism.

It's other issues that deserve the scrutiny...

considering the gaby mudi deal, lazio now owns meghni 100%.
which means 6 mln + 1.8 = 7.8 mln.
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:19 pm

We did not paid hellas verona 7 million euro for behrami Very Happy , I think 1.5million if I'm right.
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guardia alta
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:37 pm

Goerlandt wrote:
We did not paid hellas verona 7 million euro for behrami Very Happy , I think 1.5million if I'm right.

at first we bought verona's half and then, the following year, we bought genoa's second half.
total fee transfer: almost 6 millions
-----------------------

here is datasport old report

Valon Behrami e` a tutti gli effetti un giocatore della Lazio: il club ha acquistato l`altra meta` del cartellino. Manca ancora l`ufficialita`, ma Genoa e Lazio hanno raggiunto l`accordo per il nazionale svizzero. La Lazio ha chiuso l`operazione in cambio di 3 milioni di euro e il cartellino del giovane Ciani, classe ’85,

La conferma e` arrivata dal ds del Genoa, Mariano Fabiani: `Rispetto all`8 dicembre non e` cambiato nulla - ha detto a Radioincontro - Ma e` stato trovato un accordo. Non c`e` l`ufficialita`, ma una stretta di mano vale piu` di un contratto. Ci possiamo ritenere soddisfatti. Avevamo parlato anche di altri giocatori, ma per il volere dei procuratori non si e` fatto nulla` . Pare infatti che il club rossoblu volesse ingaggiare Manfredini e Inzaghi. Fabiani ha poi chiuso tornando a parlare di Behrami: `Dobbiamo rispettare i tempi per ratificare l`accordo, ma ormai il piu` e` fatto. E` stata premiata la tenacia del presidente Lotito e la volonta` del giocatore che voleva restare a Roma` .
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:25 pm

guardia alta wrote:
Goerlandt wrote:
We did not paid hellas verona 7 million euro for behrami Very Happy , I think 1.5million if I'm right.

at first we bought verona's half and then, the following year, we bought genoa's second half.
total fee transfer: almost 6 millions
-----------------------

here is datasport old report

Valon Behrami e` a tutti gli effetti un giocatore della Lazio: il club ha acquistato l`altra meta` del cartellino. Manca ancora l`ufficialita`, ma Genoa e Lazio hanno raggiunto l`accordo per il nazionale svizzero. La Lazio ha chiuso l`operazione in cambio di 3 milioni di euro e il cartellino del giovane Ciani, classe ’85,

La conferma e` arrivata dal ds del Genoa, Mariano Fabiani: `Rispetto all`8 dicembre non e` cambiato nulla - ha detto a Radioincontro - Ma e` stato trovato un accordo. Non c`e` l`ufficialita`, ma una stretta di mano vale piu` di un contratto. Ci possiamo ritenere soddisfatti. Avevamo parlato anche di altri giocatori, ma per il volere dei procuratori non si e` fatto nulla` . Pare infatti che il club rossoblu volesse ingaggiare Manfredini e Inzaghi. Fabiani ha poi chiuso tornando a parlare di Behrami: `Dobbiamo rispettare i tempi per ratificare l`accordo, ma ormai il piu` e` fatto. E` stata premiata la tenacia del presidente Lotito e la volonta` del giocatore che voleva restare a Roma` .

ah I didn't knew that , thanks
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:26 pm

you're welcome!
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Fri Sep 05, 2008 9:18 pm

Lucky Strike wrote:
centrocampista wrote:
Biancocelesti wrote:
centrocampista wrote:

Does anyone in here actually belive that Lotito will pay the 13mil option on Matuzalem?? he wouldn't spend half of that on Jimmenez. Zarate is even more expensive (give or take a few dollars).

Off topic but the option is set at €8M

Ok. The problem is that our loan deals pan out into nothing!! We didn't make any money of off behrami!!

I'm just saying today what you all will be saying (not all) at the end of the season.

What loan deals pan into nothing? Bianchi? True, he didn't succeed at Lazio - but aren't you happy with Matuzalem? With Zarate? Once again: we do not have the money to buy all these players in one time (for the moment), and that is not Lotito's fault, you have to go back in history (before Lotito's era) to find the cause of our financial situation nowadays. Be happy he's bringing in these amazing players, while (!) making sure our finances are ok. I'm pretty damn satisfied with the transfers this season. Zarate - brilliant, Carrizo - brilliant, Matuzalem - brilliant, Lichtsteiner - very good, Rozehnal - solid, Radu - solid and promising, Brocchi - fair enough, Rocchi & Pandev renewals - brilliant.

- I don't really know Matuzalem that well. He was good in italy back when he made his break but since then I've seen very little of him. Hopefully he'll put Ledesma on the bench but so far I just don't know. Besides he is a loan and his buy-out clause is too much for us and he's no spring chicken.

- Zarate seems cool and a dream would be if he became our new beppe :). His buy-out clause is high but he's young and could be worth it.

Again both are loan deals and what's to say they will want to play for us if they succeed?

This will happen if Zarate scores 20goals.

At the office of Zarates agent:

"Speaking!"

"Hello this is the manager of (milan/Inter/Juve/insert PL team) we are interested in this Karate dude"

"oh you mean Zarate"

"uhm yes the dude that scored 20 goals .. Karate"

"Yes I'm his agent how can I help you?"

"well we want to buy him but we don't want to pay Lazio"

"no problem!! Zarate will just go to the media and say he hates Lazio"

"deal!!"

This is more or less what happened with Jimmenez.

Oh, and by the way, we got about 10 million dollars for Behrami (to West Ham United), and we got about 6 million euro (!) for Mudingayi (to Bologna), who Lotito brought in for free just a couple of years ago. Just saying.
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Sat Sep 06, 2008 5:16 am

Jimenez was different, the option was a high price and in the end I'm not sure if anyone knows what happened exactly. Zarate is different because I think we have the first option meaning if we want him for the quoted price then we have to get him if we offer it.
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Sat Sep 06, 2008 11:21 am

Caxi wrote:
Jimenez was different, the option was a high price and in the end I'm not sure if anyone knows what happened exactly. Zarate is different because I think we have the first option meaning if we want him for the quoted price then we have to get him if we offer it.
We also had a first option to sign Jimenez and a quoted price was around 11mln euros.
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Sat Sep 06, 2008 5:54 pm

Concerining Zarate, we will be paying for his contact in installments. If i remember right, we will pay 3m Euros for his loan, and have an option on signing half of his contract at the end of the season for 5.5m Euros, and then pay another 8.5m Euros at the end of the following season for the other half of the contract.
.
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Sat Sep 06, 2008 6:17 pm

Gizas wrote:
Caxi wrote:
Jimenez was different, the option was a high price and in the end I'm not sure if anyone knows what happened exactly. Zarate is different because I think we have the first option meaning if we want him for the quoted price then we have to get him if we offer it.
We also had a first option to sign Jimenez and a quoted price was around 11mln euros.

but we didn't pay it and Inter did, there was talk of compensation there because I think Inter wanted to buy out our option but the situation was different because Jimenez was supposed to be a 2 year loan agreement and this is a 1 year loan with installments.
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Tue Sep 09, 2008 2:53 am

Weninho wrote:
Jimenez specifically asked to leave. You can say a lot of things about Lotito, but in this case I don't see how he could have made anything different. However, there are rumors that Jimenez in reality only was brought to Rome part of a bigger deal, built up by favors in one way and another. Not sure how much is truth do.

Ultimately, I don't think the Jimenez situation is comparable to Zarate.
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Tue Sep 09, 2008 8:30 am

In my opinion, Lotito is a great businessman with no people skills. Since Lotito took over the club I've been one of the few people who defended him when it comes to his transfer policies, but in my opinion his biggest problem is his relation with the fans, the players and the staff. I never said Lotito is perfect, but who is? and it's just annoying to listen to some of these comments were people's hate for Lotito makes them turn the blind eye on his achievements (financially and on the pitch). Just be objective with your opinion regardless of your beef with the guy.

Some of you guys never give credit to the guy for getting us a CL spot in 3 years when we're in the risk of going bankrupt. I liked Lucky Strike and Wheninho's posts were both of them tried to give the goods and the bad things about Lotito and not just bash the guy or make him a god.

For some of us who don't live in Italy, we don't know much about how people in Rome feel about Lotito, what did he take away and what did he bring to the club, but from what I understood even in the city there's a split opinion about what he's doing. Ermetico mentioned something about loosing friends because of this issue, so I imagine not every Laziale in Italy hates the guy. With all that said I would like to point what I learned about the guy in his time with Lazio.

The Pros I see in Lotito being the president are his business skills (taking us from bankruptcy to a healthy financial situation), his reluctance to overspend and to overpay for some players or some teams, I see the Loan with the option to buy as the ideal way to buy a player especially when you barely have the money to buy them (Bianchi is an ideal example think about if we would have bought him last year, the guy was a complete flop and it was only right to send him back. Mendieta rings any bells to anyone??). I don't understand how is avoiding the same mistakes that brought us to bankruptcy could be seen as mismanagement!!!

On the other side I do think that Lotito is stubborn and he needs to respect people more, especially the fans, the players and the staff. I agree that we lost some key players because of the way he deals with them and in my opinion he takes it more personally than what he should.
I think it was stupid to loose Sereni,
it was stupid to fire Papadopulos,
it was wrong to let Di Canio go the way he did,
it's beyond me why did he disrespect Perruzi the way he did
it's stupid to loose Stendardo the way we are
and I have no idea why would you get to this point with Ledesma.
Behrami wanted to go, but Mudingayi didn't and I'm not sure if Rossi has to do with any of these situations, but he's not much better than Lotito when it comes to dealing with players!!! Why did Zauri leave??

I think Lotito needs to understand that he may own more than 51% of Lazio but without the fans he's never gonna get anywhere, he needs to respect people in general (fans, players and staff).

At the same time some of the fans should give the guy credit for what he's doing for the team, taking it from the bottom to a 3rd spot in 3 years is not something too many people could do. And maybe they should stop worrying about how much money he's spending and just look at the results.

I see a bright future for Lazio, out of debts with a new stadium and hopefully in a couple years Lotito will learn were he's made some mistakes and how important are the fans for this project.
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Wed Sep 10, 2008 2:20 am

zaak wrote:

At the same time some of the fans should give the guy credit for what he's doing for the team, taking it from the bottom to a 3rd spot in 3 years is not something too many people could do. And maybe they should stop worrying about how much money he's spending and just look at the results.

I agree with you on that Zaak.
Lotito may not be the nicest person or the one who cares too much about peoples socio-emotional needs, but he has done very well I also believe in raising Lazio up when things were gloomy. He gets the tasks done and has brought in a good coach, good young players who have shown their worth and above all, good positions on the table (apart from last season). If he could give more respect, like you mentioned Zaak, to players, coach and staff, then it could really improve things at the club. Hiring Tare was a good idea I believe as he is well adored and respected by everyone. Hopefully Mr Lotito continues in this manner towards building up Lazio. Grazie Claudio!!!!
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Wed Sep 10, 2008 5:01 pm

Caxi wrote:
Weninho wrote:
Jimenez specifically asked to leave. You can say a lot of things about Lotito, but in this case I don't see how he could have made anything different. However, there are rumors that Jimenez in reality only was brought to Rome part of a bigger deal, built up by favors in one way and another. Not sure how much is truth do.

Ultimately, I don't think the Jimenez situation is comparable to Zarate.

jimenez went to chile in summer time and then stated to press that he wanted to leave.
officially was delio's fault because he considere him not reliable as mauri.

on the other hand everyone knows here in italy that roberto mancini asked the guy to set up a media mess.
inter excellent money was ready for him.

btw he 's a bencher now and mourinho with his 433 doesn't consider him to play as a a winger nor as midfielder.
simply there's no room.
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PostSubject: Re: Claudio Lotito   Sat Sep 13, 2008 2:17 am

Seems Di Canio could sue Lotito over recent comments made about him. This is the last thing we need...
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